I'm really enjoying this season. Every episode has truly showcased the amazing talent of Sam Heughan. From the opener on the battlefield, to his desolation when living in the cave, to the Ardsmuir scenes with John Grey, his ability to convey every nuance, every emotion is so deeply moving. I watched all these episodes multiple times just to see him. People have said that his acting ability has been shortchanged because of his wonderful looks and uncanny resemblance to the Jamie of the book. He hasn't seemed to get the credit he surely deserves, but to me, he is the most gifted actor in the cast, and I am taking nothing away from the other fabulous actors in the show.
I was overjoyed to see that Murtagh made it to Season 3. This was a departure from the book that I thoroughly welcomed. Will he show up in Carolina? Let's just hope.
I really have warmed to Lord John Grey. Maybe it's the actor. I wasn't fond of book John Grey because of something that happens in one of the last books.
Liked Geneva Dunsany more that I thought I would. Looked her up. She has a British mother but grew up in Virginia.
Was getting very tired of Frank and Claire. In the book, Frank was not involved with just one other woman. His exploits in infidelity ran into the double digits. In a way, I was sorry for him because he could never hope to compete with Claire's great and epic love for Jamie. My favorite line from Frank was about Claire's throwing an ashtray at him. "Your aim was spot on. It was my catlike reflexes that saved me". He could be somewhat witty. But, how could you ever get over the face of Black Jack Randall?
Starting this season, I was waiting with baited breath for Claire to return to Jamie. Looking at my DISH magazine the other day, there is an indication that this will not happen until episode 7. I'd hoped for earlier, and can't think what they'll do with the next two episodes. I feel like they're dragging it out. Claire went back about a third of the way through the book, not over half way.
Thanks, Carol and Tracy for your observations, opinions and all the fun. It's good to see you back after the draughtlander.
Print Shop will be in Episode 6. This episode was Jamie-centric, next episode will be Claire-centric ending on a cliffhanger of Claire arriving at the Print Shop but not yet entering. Oh, the agony!
That's all I could think about while watching the bedroom scene between the two of them. Geneva's facial expressions, and her eyes, and the way she looked at Jamie were so reminiscent of Claire—so much so that I thought that was the show's intention!
Carol, just as you like to make up your own ending, I found myself customizing Jamie's entire internal narrative, thinking that he just HAD to be imagining Claire and the wedding night in that moment, and wanted to pay it forward. :P Also, I thought he was so... passionate with Geneva that there was no way he wasn't in some sense thinking of Claire. (And Geneva's resemblance certainly would've helped achieve that.) But who knows.. Obviously we each take away our own imaginings of one's motives behind their actions.
Yes, I absolutely thought Geneva and Claire looked so much alike; even the way she said "I liked it" reminded me of Claire's statement during the wedding. I wonder if during his recounting of this later (if that happens in the show), he might mention that?
A great hour plus with you gals. Prayers for Tom going out. As a Dylan fan was thrilled to hear his Hard Rain at the end. Am not fond of them inserting the "women can't sit at the bar" scene. I'm glad they did the scene with Geneva and Jamie having sex as they did. I will have to go read the book again but I always thought Geneva did have sex with Lord Elsmere but he still suspected her of not being a virgin. It wouldn't make sense that he would accept her pregnancy if he hadn't had sex with her. I'm glad they make the Isobel character so nice. And I love Book Lord John and now love TV Lord John. I thought this episode was well done. Although I don't like the actress playing Bree and I wasn't liking Claire very much this episode. Good job ladies! Enjoy the longer reviews.
Agree that Brie is not Brie! You know who is? Nicole Kidman in Far and Away! A tall Amazon, curly long red hair, fair, and a she-devil. This Brie is not right. She needs to be a force of nature- she needs to be crazy tall. That is so important to her whole persona. Brie is supposed to make people stop and stare when she walks in. They could have done better!
please remember book jamie is very ruddy, tall, hairy (even his ankles are hairy), heavy muscled (perhaps like football player), rough in appearance...claire is average height 5'4/6", buxom with more prominent round arse...so the cast does not well approximate the book...just different... based more on acting ability than looks ???
Hi Ladies, Carol, a heartfelt embrace/support of your family's summer. 30 years post for me personally. HEA an absolute reality.
304: I have never more enjoyed the fact that my husband is a non book reader viewer. The story became a true drama through his eyes and questions of "what's going to happen next". I forget what a surprise the story telling becomes. We paused a number of times for me to fill in a back story. It reminded me of when book based mini series first became popular on tv. Someone in the family usually had read the book and we compared and discussed as the series rolled along. MOP reminds me of those fun discussions.
Loved the visuals of this particular episode...beautiful.
This episode was really all about Jamie, and how he has moved on, fathered a child with another woman, and now grieves over the loss of his bastard son. No mention of Claire.... and the conversation he has with Willie about a wife??? Jamie could have been talking about his favorite horse in the stables. Where was my line!!! "Lord that she may be safe, she and the child." Nothing. Jamie hasn't grieved for Claire in a long time, all but forgotten. I think, anyone who says differently is projecting their knowledge of the books onto the show, because it's ALL in the book. Jamie never gets over Claire, in the book, but show? not so much.
But what of Claire? Oh yes, she is still grieving, and now that she knows Jamie lived, she's hard at work looking for him. Jamie is always front and center in Claire's storyline, driving her story. Next ep., Claire's line, "Will he still love me?" I don't know Claire, there's not a lot of evidence in Jamie's story to substantiate that, but lord knows your story certainly shows your loss for Jamie...
I'd have to respectively disagree regarding Jamie lacking any grieving for Claire. He was marinating in it throughout the entire episode. And no, I'm not projecting. Even the non-book readers vlogs I've been listening to have found his grief palpable.
I also feel that it's very clear Jamie has not moved on. You can just see it all over his face. He's also still lighting candles and praying to St. Anthony for Claire and Brianna (and others he has lost). Being able to have sex one time with Mary McNab, when he was about to go to prison for what he thought was probably the rest of his life, and being blackmailed into sex with Geneva does not equal getting over Claire. In my opinion of course :).
I remember Jamie feeling very bad that he caused the death of Geneva because the baby was so large. I remember him laying prostrate on a church floor. It was such a moving part of the book to me. I really wanted to see it. I felt he had a "little" love for the lass. I'm one who would have liked to get to know her better. I don't think she was all that of a bad person, just young and immature. I felt sorry she died so young. Maybe it was in another book and not this one as he is recalling that time period.
They didn't mention that the reason Geneva was being forced to marry the old guy was because the Dunsany's needed his money as far as I remember. They were broke. That's why she could have never married Hal.
Absolutely! LOL, I catch myself thinking of the books as the "real" story, like the show is adapting history,not just better fiction. I was about to say how happy I was to see someone pointing out the FACTS. Lol
First, let me wish your family all the best with the medical crisis! I can't even imagine.
When I wasn't laughing along, I jotted down a few things. Similarity between Geneva and Claire's appearance to me was uncanny. I didn't, however, see ANY between Jamie and Willie. Was that just me? Looked it up, Hal and Minnie were married in 1750, so he'd have already been married at this point. Visually, Claire has been so "beige" this season (when she wasn't being green as per Frank). Makes me wonder if the colors will be vibrant when she goes back (much like the before and after of her laying at the stones in Season 1 - total shift of color palette). Also a good metaphor to her boring life in contrast to how exciting it was with Jamie. I'd also suspect next week is all about Claire, Bree and Roger and we are not shown another big event in Jamie's life (book readers will know what I mean). The audience will learn about that when Claire does!!
Just thought I'd share this... apparently, even Hanna James is aware of her resemblance to Claire In an interview on yahoo, the actress commented on it:
First, the interviewer's comment: Jamie maybe even recognizes some of what he loves about Claire in Geneva. She’s also a very independent woman who pursues her own desires.
Hannah James' reply: Geneva is strident, but also spunky. And she’s a lot younger than Claire too, so maybe she’s like a younger version of Claire [to Jamie]. A lot of people think I look like Caitriona [Balfe], and wonder if [the producers] meant to do that. I don’t think it was an intentional thing, but it is interesting to have that underlying it.
Regarding Willie's resemblance to Jamie, here's what Gabaldon had to say in that regard:
Exactly right. Jamie (if y'all remember ) notes with relief that Baby Willie's "features were snub, rounded, and resembled no one at all". And later, when contemplating the need to leave, reflects that the resemblance isn't yet clear enough to be a danger, but with time, Willie's "bones would emerge" and the likeness be made clear--and Jamie dare not wait for that to happen.
Thank you for sharing the news about Mr. Tom. So glad to hear that the prognosis is so good! I always love to hear Tom's take on Clare and the Outlander universe. Sending heaps of positive vibrations to y'all.
Thank you, Mary. We have fun with Tom and he has fun with us (when he's in the mood to have fun with us. LOL!) He was actually in the examining room yesterday - in a hospital gown (while being prepped for some radiation equipment) - being a wiseguy and cracking new "Deep Thoughts with Tom" jokes. They were quite hilarious...and I'm going to try my best to get him to record some audio for us so we can all have a good laugh. 👍🏼 PS - Love your last name!! ☺️Are you a Game of Thrones fan, too?
Almost everything you two said was exactly what we said during our watching. Jamie’s Helwater clothes, although wonderful, not what I “saw”in the book. The “shoveling s***” conversation in a very public place. Love love Lord John... kind of wanted him to be blonde. Rodger is truly adorable. That scene with baby carriage in the woods confused me. Where did the extra guy on horse on Jamie’s left come from? It was a beautiful location. Walking away from the carriage had be saying “you forgot the baby!” Sleeping with her husband had to happen or the baby thing would have been an issue earlier. Loved the Dylan song! Loved that this is Jamie’s story not so much Claire’s. Sam deserves so much praise! Wow!
Did you notice Rodger holding the airplane from his childhood? Such a great moment
Carole your family is in my prayers. You guys got me through a year of my battle eighteen months ago. Sometimes you were my only source of laughter. I went back and watched all your old videos. It was a tough time but I am here to testify this to will pass. I am stronger and healthier than ever. Hang in there!
OMG Kare. Talk about getting choked up. Thank you for letting us know that. Now that we're going through it in my house, it means that much more. Tom and I listen to a comedian called Sebastian Maniscalco sometimes on our (long assed LOL) drive home from the hospital in Philadelphia...and he gets me through it and makes me laugh...so I totally understand that and am touched that you'd say that about Tracey and me. 😘 I am SO glad to hear you're doing well. God bless you. ❤️
Yeah why isn't Lord John blonde? Love this actor, he is perfect but he needs to be blonde. What's the big deal, they gave Sam red hair, gave poor Kat a frizzy perm, why not dye Lord John blonde? Don't get it, it's an easy fix. And he is pretty enough to putt it off!
First of all... Fruit Flies!!! I have them too - driving me crazy! I've done the juice in a cup with pin-pricked Saran on top to catch them - only makes more. I've cleared my counters and sprayed (I HATE spraying sh$& in my house!) - helps for a wee minute. Now I have manufactured an ingenious trap of red wine (they swarm me when I'm drinking it, and I can NOT put my glass down ��). I then dabbed molasses all over the top and sides - yes, very messy- and they are swarming and getting stuck, so we shall see. Maddening.
I, too, am happy about the way they portrayed the Jamie/Geneva scene. But ONLY because I did not want our beloved story to be attacked en masse on social media for having a "rape" scene. I never, not for one second thought of it as rape in the book version. Sheesh! People are too freakin' sensitive! It's fiction! It's a story, folks. But I begrudgingly understand.
This episode is only the second time I have sobbed during show Outlander. i can only assume it's because I always know what's coming. Don't get me wrong, I love the show with all my heart - kind of obsessed, actually, with seeing it brought to life, but it doesn't usually hit me hard like the books did.
I'm ready for the hate about my observations on the Geneva thing, so sticks and stones and all that - bring it on.
Thanks Carla! I will try the red wine/molasses trick! I've lived in my house for 24 years and they've never been this bad! Someone suggested a new plant might be causing them...and I do root quite a few plants on my windowsill...so maybe they're attracted to one of the newer types I've put up there. PS - LOVED your sheesh/fiction comment. I couldn't agree more. People need to lighten up! Everyone needs to relax and have a laugh (or glass of wine LOL) and not be so sensitive! 😘
Hi all....as much as I love these books, I am one of those that was VERY uncomfortable with the way this was handled in the books (something along the lines of "he put his hand over her mouth and pushed"). I did feel it crossed a line. However, I understand Jamie was worried that if the sex didn't occur, then Geneva might reveal his secrets as she had threatened. I guess I'm just very glad the series handled it differently.
I didn't think of the Jamie/Geneva scene in the book as rape- (in fact I had forgotten about that until Carol and Tracy mentioned it. I am happy with the direction the show took that scene.
The Geneva actress was driving me crazy because of the strange resemblance to Clare (in the book I thought she had blond hair) and because I could not place where I had seen her before, and then I realized she was on Mercy Street! I did not know that Mercy Street had been canceled and I am a little bummed about that! Shame on PBS.
The Wille / Jamie / Lord John scenes made me cry! Pulling at the heart strings every episode this season.
Clarification on Lord Ellesmere: In the book Jamie is getting the lowdown on Geneva's pregnancy form the kitchen maid in Ellesmere's household (along with the other groomsmen that went). Jamie has know idea that the child could be his, until the maid tells them that Geneva's sheets were clean on her wedding night; that's when Jamie realizes he is the father. The maid tells them that Ellesmere doted on Geneva at first, but when her pregnancy started to show he became angry, and they fought like cats and dogs. So Ellesmere knew the child was not his all along. I find the way it was handled in the show weird and confusing.
That the sheets were clean on the wedding night could indicate either she was not a virgin or they had not consummated the marriage. Makes no difference which. That he doted on her until her pregnancy showed that consummation probably had not taken place. Perhaps he couldn't rise to the challenge. Either way, his doting would have stopped in private, but he would never have humiliated himself or discredited his only heir by publicly announcing that he had been cuckolded. I don't see how the show show's handling of that was weird or confusing.
That song at the end was like a knife to my battered heart! Great to discover Walk off the Earth - Hope we get a Gif from Julia LeBlanc using 'Hard Rain'
I love the PMOP I think you called it.The way you laugh and set each other off is so fun. My prayers for Tom and family(yes I made it through the hour mark easily. As a book reader I think this season is hitting the marks. I too read into whats happening so when my non book reader are confused about whats happening I want to give a long explanation how it happened in the book the way I remember it. I resolved not to do that this season and just enjoy. FYI even though it was a weird scene did anyone notice that the singer in the bar was the "sassenech" gypsy that stole Claire and Murtaghs song?
I just want to say in the book when Frank is telling Claire he wants to go back to England and take Brianna he does tell her I thought I was being discreet about it so if that not saying I was cheating on you I don't know what it says. I just wanted to say that.
My reading of the whole Geneva looking at Jamie after Lord Ellesmere said the Vile comment was her going "Oh, the red head freaks you out? Well, why don't I just get me some that?" It's her way of rebelling against the whole situation, the one thing she could do to take control of her path...although her execution of said control is not necessarily the best way of handling things...I think she could have gone to Jamie in a more gentile, matter-of-fact manner, asking, instead of demanding, and he may have been a far more willing partner...the entire undercurrent of non-consent gives me a very particular unease...but, no biggie, it's all part of the story, and the show handled the whole thing far better than the book...I thank them for that...
And oh hey, Carol? It is completely possible to thoroughly enjoy your first time, no pain, no blood, no problems, only good times, baby...trust me...wink wink...yep :) Oh, and darling Tom, kick butt and take names!!! You got this, love <3
There was "a moment" when Geneva and Jamie were out riding (before he dropped her in the puddle) where Geneva asks Jamie what he finds attractive in a women and he responds that he doesn't think of those things and she calls him a liar. Did you notice the pause and look he gives her? What was that about? Jamie noticing the resemblance between Claire and Geneva? Just something that caught my attention and want to know if anyone else did too.
YES!! I noticed and I just thought it was because he was mad that she'd refer to him as a "liar." My husband is a bit wonky about that, too. Think it's an honor thing. BUT I don't know, maybe I'm wrong! I like your theory!! 👍🏼
Thank you both again for your recaps. I'm sure that making these aren't always convenient - especially after the summer you've had, Carol (sending prayers for your family) - but know that they're always greatly appreciated. You never fail to give me some good, well-needed laughs.
I've become so accustomed lately to being annoyed by some of this show's choices and changes to characters that it feels like a near painful bending of my pride to have to admit how much I enjoyed this episode. This was definitely a good one, and it's nice to be able to say that. I was so dreading the potential mishandling of the Jamie/Geneva situation, that I brought up my concern to Maril on Twitter a few months ago. I feared they'd use this opportunity to blacken Jamie's character, and her run-around answer (in the form of a question, something like "How do you think that scene blackens him?") certainly didn't reassure me. I had no problem with the book scene, but I know the debate. I'm just so glad they opted to not "go there."
I agree, Willie looks NOTHING like Jamie, but I did love those scenes. Like Tracey, I thought the snake was a sweet change - especially the way it ties into Jamie's brother and to his own treasured Sawney. Besides, I had always wondered how a small child, especially one surrounded by servants, would be able to hide a rosary.
I'm seeing a lot of deserved kudos for Geneva, but I especially like Isobel. The character has a level-headed, Elinor Dashwood/Emma Thompson kind of vibe. I'm also loving LJG, which was never the case for me with the books. Berry is doing a great job.
I'm really hoping we'll soon see the return of "lovable Claire." I love book Claire and have hated the way the show has portrayed her, especially as seen through the eyes of poor, martyred St. Frank (grrr! Don't get me started!). Ive heard too many viewers say they don't like Claire, and that kind of breaks my heart. I hope they will rehabilitate her. The one shot we've seen of that beatific look on her face when she finds the print shop gives me hope. I'm keeping my fingers crossed.
Non-book reader here. Didn’t get a chance to comment last week about this, but since it came up again thought I’d throw my two cents in.
I haven’t seen Claire as bitchy or mean at all during the time we see her. She’s come off as someone who can’t get over losing the love of their life. Yes I did feel bad for Frank, but he made his choice to stay. He didn’t leave because of Brianna and it’s not like he was forced to live as some kind of monk. And the open marriage thing was probably pretty common during that time, it was just never agreed upon by the wife! So I like that they had Claire take control in that respect.
Now for this episode - I believe he would’ve offered himself to Lord John. He has a history of using his/offering his body for various reasons, so why wouldn’t he? I mean he allowed himself to get whipped, beat up (dumb Leghair), wedding night, offered himself to Black Jack to save Claire, the Geneva thing etc. Of course the wedding night was a bit more enjoyable than others and BJR messed with more than his body, but overall it has been something he does especially if it has to do with his loved ones.
I agree with you about Jamie offering himself to LJG, I think the the latter explanation of The Test was a gay panic ret-con, honestly...he Kisses LJG at the end of the scene in the book, and I was actually sad that they left that pretty big detail out of the show...I mean, that's a pretty significant thing forJamie to do...I think by this time, poor Jamie has been passed around so much he probably has a fairly big disconnect from the act itself, and his sense of self. He even explains to Geneva about it just being Feelings roused in her body, not True love. He has a pretty pragmatic approach to sex by now...what he shared with Claire can never be touched by any physical act with another...so why not toss it out to LJG? Its all he has to give, anyways, aside from frienship, which of course, LJG heartily accepts because he is a wonderful human...
Thank you for dissecting the episodes!! I enjoy your insights and banter so much each week, and I really appreciate that your video is available so quickly after the episode is aired. You help add layers of storyline that give depth and life to each character and situation, and that keeps the episode alive for a while longer for me.
Carol, thank you for gracefully sharing your family's struggle with the MOP community. Thinking of you and looking forward to good progress reports in the coming months. 🌈
so on to the show|. I haven't seen any comment regarding Richard Rankin's role as the dashing your doctor on The Crimson Fields. I was excited to see him cast as Roger because I so enjoyed him in that PBS show. If you haven't seen TCF, it was only one short season, but worth watching, definitely. My only issue with this week's episode was this: why didn't Geneva make sure that she had marital relations with her husband immediately, so as to squash any questions about who sired the child? Seems a no brained to me, could she have been so ignorant so as not to understand the biology behind pregnancy, or so stupid and evil not to care?
Hi all. I'm a newcomer here (from Pittsburgh) and have really enjoyed the recaps that I've watched so far. I started watching the series before reading the books so I'm now catching up with the books as well. I liked the Jamie-centric episode and the expression on his face as he was riding away really goes right through you. Does anyone else think his face looks more gaunt than in the past? Maybe it's in keeping with the time spent in prison.
I agree with you about the Barbara Streisand look to Claire's hair and makeup. I was thinking Laurie Petrie from Dick Van Dyke as well.
I was glad that you mentioned the show A Place to Call Home that David Berry appeared in. I watched the series a few months ago and it's really good. There is a beautiful historic house that is featured in it as well.
Looking forward to the next recap and being a part of the group!
Welcome Ann! Tracey and I are from Paoli, originally...outside Philadelphia. So PENNSYLVANIA REPRESENT! :)
PS - My neighbor Teresa (who is quickly becoming my go-to for non-reader opinions) can't stand Claire's 60s hair to the point of distraction (not that it's not well-done)...and says she thinks she looks so much prettier with her messy 18th century hair! :)
I was not surprised to hear there was a controversy about the rape at Hellwater, until I realized y'all were talking about GENEVA as the VICTIM! When you blackmail someone into having sex with you, you are the RAPIST. It might not have been as ugly, but Geneva is as guily as Black Jack. The test: I think the books make it very clear that the real test was to see if LJG would take sexual advantage of a person in his charge, knowing they really didn't want to. After BJR, Jamie could never think of a man in that way and he was willing to hang for John's murder to protect Willie. A modern spin on JAMMF and LJG's relationship might include some erotic undertones that one cannot admit, but let's consider the character. JAMMF does not lie, especially to himself.
Agreed about the modern spin, Julia. Jamie never intended to do anything with LJG; it was only an offer...to test LJG's honor. About the sex...Tracey and I didn't think Jamie raped Geneva. We were referring to conversations online that have been going on for years about it. Unfortunately there are people out there who forget they're reading fiction - and fiction about 200 years ago, at that - and get upset about certain situations that go on in the books. I just shake my head and scroll on by. :)
Julia I agree completely with your assessment of the test. I think Tracey was on the right track that Jamie was willing to do whatever he could to protect Willie. I just think his offer wasn't in gratitude, but to makie sure LJG would be honorable enough to be able to put Willie's best interests above his own selfish desires.
This was so Jamie's episode. He outshone everyone else, hands down. I thought this was. so far, the best episode of the season and was superb. In the podcast Matt Roberts says that even though Willie did not look like Jamie, he carried himself just as Jamie does. They all saw that in casting him and he was a unanimous choice. He didn't look like him but I could see the same pride and assurance. Lord John. Wow! He and Jamie can both communicate brilliantly and emotionally in complete silence.
Carol, I have added both you and Tom to my prayers and hope that progress and healing continue for him.
I am so grateful I found your site! I love you guys! I am also a PA girl transplanted in NJ who also went to school in Philly, so when you guys talk I feel like I know you (even though I know I don’t!). I look forward to your videos every week because it’s so great to break down the episodes with people who have read the books. All of my friends that I have turned on to the show have not read the books so I need your videos!!
I totally agree with all of your points on this episode. Lord John is one of my favorite characters from the book and I love, Love, Love David Berry. Tracey- I was cracking up when you said Lord John is hot AF because that’s what I was thinking all episode! The scene where Jamie offered himself to LJ was so perfect - it couldn’t have been better played.
Looking forward to more great episodes as I agree with you guys th the first 2 were a liittle underwhelming.
Carol- thoughts and prayers to you and Tom. What horrible thing to have to go through. I can attest to the great docs at U of P. My sister was there a couple years ago with a serious illness and they are amazing. I wish Tom a speedy recovery
I'm so happy with this season because we get more Jamie time. I love the books because of Jamie, and the relationship between Jamie and Claire. It's not that I don't like Claire, it's just that I enjoy Jamie's personality more. I admire book Claire (I'd have been dead in 10 minutes flat if I'd gone through the stones) but especially in the first book or 2 she did too many thoughtless, ill-considered things for me to really like her. For me, show Claire is a bit softer and more likable. (and Caitriona Balff is terrific!) I hope it's not blasphemy to not love Claire...
Speaking of Jamie, Sam Heughan is blowing me away this season. Before season 1 when I saw his photo I was ok with his casting but now he IS JAMMF to me. Slow golf clap! Lol
Carol, 2 things: first, I'm praying for Tom and your whole family. I know what a scary and overwhelming time you've had/are having, so I'm praying for peace of mind and comfort for you all. Second, I'm Catholic, so I would love to be able to buy a t-shirt from the MOP store that has "Stinking Papist" on it! :))).
Love you guys and can’t wait to have you in my home again each week. This was one of my favorite episodes so far. I think we are just getting a chance this season to see what a fine actor Sam is and FINALLY he's getting his chance to shine. I think about everything has been said, but one comment I had about book vs. show. I loved the change of the carved snake vs. the cross. In the book, I never understood how a little boy was going to hid that big crucifix and the fact that he had become a “stinking papist”, but the snake makes much more sense as a reminder of Jamie and will be as dear to him as the Sawney snake was to Jamie as a reminder of his dead brother. I also loved the LJG and Jamie scenes. David Berry is exactly like I pictured Lord John and he and Sam are perfect as best buds. If you haven’t watched A Place To Call Home, don’t miss it. Carol, sending light and love to you and Tom as you go through this tough time. I’m sure many of us who follow you have been through similar experiences and know the ups and downs that your days are filled with. Thank you for sharing with your MOP family. Tracey, your hair looked fabulous this week!
Hey guys, this episode is my favorite. Loved Geneva, Love Jamie and LJG, love William. Roger and Richard Rankin is wonderful.You can all throw things, but I am not bothered by Bree too much. I do think Roger and Bree have some chemistry at least. Now a message for Carol and Tom. I understand what you guys are going through we had a similar experience with my father and colon cancer this summer. All is well and they caught everything, but that was a difficult time and a long recovery. I think colon/gastrointestinal surgery is another nasty one to go through. My thoughts are with you both. Glad to hear that his prognosis is so good. Fight on MOP Tom! -Z
Hi ladies, thank you for your recaps every week. I love the in-depth discussion of all the details. Also, you are hilarious, especially when you get each other laughing! Carol, you got me this week with your "prunes" comment (referring to Lord Ellesmere's cajones).
As someone said above, in the books Lord Ellesmere was "incapable" of consummating the marriage. I don't know why he waited until the baby was born to make any comment about Geneva being pregnant by another man!
One thing about this week's episode that I haven't seen anyone comment on - in the books I don't think Claire went back to Boston because she gave up the search for Jamie - I think she found out about him, decided she would probably be going back through the stones, and went back to Boston to get her affairs in order. No big deal, just a slight difference that I noticed.
Carol, best wishes for healing and health to you and Tom. I admire how y'all are handling this with strength and humor. <3 <3
Yes, they play it differently in the show than the book...spoilers ahead, y'all, she goes back to Boston, sans Bree, to say goodbye to her 20th century life, her job, and Joe, after having possibly found Jamie...but I'm interested to see where they take this little cliffhanger, and hey, is it true they're making us wait two weeks for the freaking Print Shop?!? Oy Vey...
Tracey and Carol, I love your videos. I knit while I listen/watch, and sometimes I drop a stitch or two because you make me laugh so hard sometimes! Whoever thinks you're rude can't have any siblings, or just doesn't get how it's your familiarity and love for each other that makes it click, I'll rewind to catch the look on Carol's face sometimes when Tracey can't resist and jumps in ....sorry, too gushy? anyways, reminds me of me and my sis sometimes ... lol.
Anyhoo... I've taken to calling Lord Ellesmere...Lord Jabba the Hutt :)
Thinking PurgatoryPositive thoughts for Tom and his continued recuperation and recovery! Wow. Such and worry; wishing you and him all the best.
It may take you time to read all the posts, but I'm waaaay behind on commenting, but, oh, well, here it goes... I think someone else mentioned house plants and fruit flies. A small dish with half a grape and a few tablespoons of apple cider vinegar, covered with a tight seal of cling wrap and then a few holes punched in the top, left somewhere in the kitchen will get rid of those nasty pesky things. Regular vinegar won't work...apple cider vinegar all the way!!
I'm "loving" Terry Dresbach's 60s costumes: loving them in their accuracy, but not in the look! Claire would have likely dressed at home as a '60s housewife and mother would have dressed while at home (not a super attractive look, but accurate, I think...same with the hairdos! Wow!)
I think that as post-War Brits, Claire and Frank would have struggled a bit after moving to the U.S. Not as an excuse for Frank's snobbishness, but they did both live through the war in England (and Claire was on the Front as a battlefield nurse, PTSD, etc.), and there was much in the way of rationing and they would have done without a lot during wartime. Also, they were married just before the war, then separated through the war, where Claire was at the Front, and Frank was in London, then the trip to Scotland was their time to "reconnect" on a second honeymoon. I think, originally, Claire did love Frank, but considering her nomadic upbringing and her wartime experiences, their relationship may have ended up not so great...but lucky for Claire...JAMMF!!!
Roger losing Rev. Wakefield makes me sad when I read those parts....also, the corkboard that Rev. Wakefield had....with all the newspaper articles and bits and bobs and notes, etc., I may be mis-remembering and that's from a later part in the series...trying to not be spoilery.
I'm sure that Lady Dunseny would not have tolerated staff that didn't look neat and tidy at all times! Well-groomed groomsmen for the Lady of the House.
I love your videos!!! Thank-you. I believe you when you say you read them all...so, don't have to post a "thank-you for posting" post for me!! LOL. Cheers!
Work has been so busy, that I'm behind on watching your videos! Trying to catch up today before the next episode.
Wanted to send heartfelt best wishes and positive thoughts to Tom, Carol and the rest of your family. Cancer is terrible, no other way to say it. But I'm thankful that Tom has such a great prognosis.
I just discovered you guys, and delighted! Oh to have a sister that would read! My daughter's husband was in shock that I recommended the series and I love picturing my daughter's face when she said, who do you think gave me the book? That makes me Bennidicta! This was a great episode, and Edie Brickell sang this song for "Born on the Fourth of July". Not sure if the same one, but close. Also Tracy usually nails the stereotypes turned on their head by Diana, but the show totally missed the KISS! I think Jamie kissed Lord John in the book because he accepted that an honorable man could be gay, simply HUGE. But I think they totally missed this, and I attribute this to our totally homophobic culture. I think Jamie was testing Lord John because what if John had been attracted to Willie"s looks? I have a red-headed son, and trust me people are weird about them, so assume Jamie had radar for this sort of thing as does herself....
Re-listening to these during droughtlander; My theory for why the Grey boys didn't just marry the Dunsany Girls. In England the 2nd son doesn't inherit so only one brother would be a good match.
"A Hard Rain's A-Gonna Fall" by Bob Dylan
ReplyDeleteThe version of the song on this episode is by Walk off the Earth
Deletehttps://youtu.be/dQdjzgImgO8
💔💔💔💔💔
DeleteSo in love with the ending and the Dylan song was absolutely perfect !!! Oh, where have you been my blue eyed son ...... it took my breath away
DeleteMy husband and I, the old folks did not recognize that song. Asked my 21 y/o son, and he's like "Yeah, great song - Bob Dylan."
DeleteI'm really enjoying this season. Every episode has truly showcased the amazing talent of Sam Heughan. From the opener on the battlefield, to his desolation when living in the cave, to the Ardsmuir scenes with John Grey, his ability to convey every nuance, every emotion is so deeply moving. I watched all these episodes multiple times just to see him. People have said that his acting ability has been shortchanged because of his wonderful looks and uncanny resemblance to the Jamie of the book. He hasn't seemed to get the credit he surely deserves, but to me, he is the most gifted actor in the cast, and I am taking nothing away from the other fabulous actors in the show.
ReplyDeleteI was overjoyed to see that Murtagh made it to Season 3. This was a departure from the book that I thoroughly welcomed. Will he show up in Carolina? Let's just hope.
I really have warmed to Lord John Grey. Maybe it's the actor. I wasn't fond of book John Grey because of something that happens in one of the last books.
Liked Geneva Dunsany more that I thought I would. Looked her up. She has a British mother but grew up in Virginia.
Was getting very tired of Frank and Claire. In the book, Frank was not involved with just one other woman. His exploits in infidelity ran into the double digits. In a way, I was sorry for him because he could never hope to compete with Claire's great and epic love for Jamie.
My favorite line from Frank was about Claire's throwing an ashtray at him. "Your aim was spot on. It was my catlike reflexes that saved me". He could be somewhat witty. But, how could you ever get over the face of Black Jack Randall?
Starting this season, I was waiting with baited breath for Claire to return to Jamie. Looking at my DISH magazine the other day, there is an indication that this will not happen until episode 7. I'd hoped for earlier, and can't think what they'll do with the next two episodes. I feel like they're dragging it out. Claire went back about a third of the way through the book, not over half way.
Thanks, Carol and Tracy for your observations, opinions and all the fun. It's good to see you back after the draughtlander.
Print Shop will be in Episode 6. This episode was Jamie-centric, next episode will be Claire-centric ending on a cliffhanger of Claire arriving at the Print Shop but not yet entering. Oh, the agony!
ReplyDeleteAnd there will be a two week break between episodes 5 and 6 to make the agony even greater!!!
DeleteOh, no!! That's just cruel.
DeleteDid anyone notice that Geneva has a strong resemblance to Claire? It was a bit confusing/off putting.
ReplyDeleteThank you for pointing that out! I as beginning to wonder if it was only in my head as nobody anywhere was mentioning it...
DeleteI didn't notice that but you're NOT the first person I've seen that from today! I'll go back and watch and look for the resemblance! 👍🏼
DeleteThat's all I could think about while watching the bedroom scene between the two of them. Geneva's facial expressions, and her eyes, and the way she looked at Jamie were so reminiscent of Claire—so much so that I thought that was the show's intention!
DeleteCarol, just as you like to make up your own ending, I found myself customizing Jamie's entire internal narrative, thinking that he just HAD to be imagining Claire and the wedding night in that moment, and wanted to pay it forward. :P Also, I thought he was so... passionate with Geneva that there was no way he wasn't in some sense thinking of Claire. (And Geneva's resemblance certainly would've helped achieve that.) But who knows.. Obviously we each take away our own imaginings of one's motives behind their actions.
Yes, I absolutely thought Geneva and Claire looked so much alike; even the way she said "I liked it" reminded me of Claire's statement during the wedding. I wonder if during his recounting of this later (if that happens in the show), he might mention that?
DeleteThank you for pointing that out! I as beginning to wonder if it was only in my head as nobody anywhere was mentioning it...
ReplyDeleteA great hour plus with you gals. Prayers for Tom going out. As a Dylan fan was thrilled to hear his Hard Rain at the end. Am not fond of them inserting the "women can't sit at the bar" scene. I'm glad they did the scene with Geneva and Jamie having sex as they did. I will have to go read the book again but I always thought Geneva did have sex with Lord Elsmere but he still suspected her of not being a virgin. It wouldn't make sense that he would accept her pregnancy if he hadn't had sex with her. I'm glad they make the Isobel character so nice. And I love Book Lord John and now love TV Lord John. I thought this episode was well done. Although I don't like the actress playing Bree and I wasn't liking Claire very much this episode. Good job ladies! Enjoy the longer reviews.
ReplyDeleteThank you 😘
DeleteAgree that Brie is not Brie! You know who is? Nicole Kidman in Far and Away! A tall Amazon, curly long red hair, fair, and a she-devil. This Brie is not right. She needs to be a force of nature- she needs to be crazy tall. That is so important to her whole persona. Brie is supposed to make people stop and stare when she walks in. They could have done better!
Deleteplease remember book jamie is very ruddy, tall, hairy (even his ankles are hairy), heavy muscled (perhaps like football player), rough in appearance...claire is average height 5'4/6", buxom with more prominent round arse...so the cast does not well approximate the book...just different... based more on acting ability than
Deletelooks ???
Hi Ladies, Carol, a heartfelt embrace/support of your family's summer. 30 years post for me personally. HEA an absolute reality.
ReplyDelete304: I have never more enjoyed the fact that my husband is a non book reader viewer. The story became a true drama through his eyes and questions of "what's going to happen next". I forget what a surprise the story telling becomes. We paused a number of times for me to fill in a back story. It reminded me of when book based mini series first became popular on tv. Someone in the family usually had read the book and we compared and discussed as the series rolled along. MOP reminds me of those fun discussions.
Loved the visuals of this particular episode...beautiful.
Good for you, Susan!!! 👏🏻Thank you!! 😘
DeleteThis episode was really all about Jamie, and how he has moved on, fathered a child with another woman, and now grieves over the loss of his bastard son. No mention of Claire.... and the conversation he has with Willie about a wife??? Jamie could have been talking about his favorite horse in the stables. Where was my line!!! "Lord that she may be safe, she and the child." Nothing. Jamie hasn't grieved for Claire in a long time, all but forgotten. I think, anyone who says differently is projecting their knowledge of the books onto the show, because it's ALL in the book. Jamie never gets over Claire, in the book, but show? not so much.
ReplyDeleteBut what of Claire? Oh yes, she is still grieving, and now that she knows Jamie lived, she's hard at work looking for him. Jamie is always front and center in Claire's storyline, driving her story. Next ep., Claire's line, "Will he still love me?" I don't know Claire, there's not a lot of evidence in Jamie's story to substantiate that, but lord knows your story certainly shows your loss for Jamie...
Sorry, I'm feeling a little saucy today lol.
OMG Jan I love this commentary. And I love that you're saucy today. 😂 You go, girl!
DeleteI love you gals!!! Your so much fun to listen to:)
DeleteI'd have to respectively disagree regarding Jamie lacking any grieving for Claire. He was marinating in it throughout the entire episode. And no, I'm not projecting. Even the non-book readers vlogs I've been listening to have found his grief palpable.
DeleteI also feel that it's very clear Jamie has not moved on. You can just see it all over his face. He's also still lighting candles and praying to St. Anthony for Claire and Brianna (and others he has lost). Being able to have sex one time with Mary McNab, when he was about to go to prison for what he thought was probably the rest of his life, and being blackmailed into sex with Geneva does not equal getting over Claire. In my opinion of course :).
DeleteLisa in Georgia
Prayers for Tom.
ReplyDeleteI remember Jamie feeling very bad that he caused the death of Geneva because the baby was so large. I remember him laying prostrate on a church floor. It was such a moving part of the book to me. I really wanted to see it. I felt he had a "little" love for the lass. I'm one who would have liked to get to know her better. I don't think she was all that of a bad person, just young and immature. I felt sorry she died so young. Maybe it was in another book and not this one as he is recalling that time period.
Thank you, Luanne! 😘
DeleteI think the scene of jamie on the church floor was in scottish prisoner or custom of the blade, not the main outlander books
DeleteThey didn't mention that the reason Geneva was being forced to marry the old guy was because the Dunsany's needed his money as far as I remember. They were broke. That's why she could have never married Hal.
ReplyDeletePer "A Fugitive Green", Hal and Minnie were married in 1745. So he was already married ten years before his appearance in this episode.
ReplyDeleteAbsolutely! LOL, I catch myself thinking of the books as the "real" story, like the show is adapting history,not just better fiction. I was about to say how happy I was to see someone pointing out the FACTS. Lol
DeleteFirst, let me wish your family all the best with the medical crisis! I can't even imagine.
ReplyDeleteWhen I wasn't laughing along, I jotted down a few things. Similarity between Geneva and Claire's appearance to me was uncanny. I didn't, however, see ANY between Jamie and Willie. Was that just me?
Looked it up, Hal and Minnie were married in 1750, so he'd have already been married at this point.
Visually, Claire has been so "beige" this season (when she wasn't being green as per Frank). Makes me wonder if the colors will be vibrant when she goes back (much like the before and after of her laying at the stones in Season 1 - total shift of color palette). Also a good metaphor to her boring life in contrast to how exciting it was with Jamie. I'd also suspect next week is all about Claire, Bree and Roger and we are not shown another big event in Jamie's life (book readers will know what I mean). The audience will learn about that when Claire does!!
Great video!
Just thought I'd share this... apparently, even Hanna James is aware of her resemblance to Claire In an interview on yahoo, the actress commented on it:
DeleteFirst, the interviewer's comment:
Jamie maybe even recognizes some of what he loves about Claire in Geneva. She’s also a very independent woman who pursues her own desires.
Hannah James' reply:
Geneva is strident, but also spunky. And she’s a lot younger than Claire too, so maybe she’s like a younger version of Claire [to Jamie]. A lot of people think I look like Caitriona [Balfe], and wonder if [the producers] meant to do that. I don’t think it was an intentional thing, but it is interesting to have that underlying it.
How awesome. Thanks for posting this, Barb.
DeleteRegarding Willie's resemblance to Jamie, here's what Gabaldon had to say in that regard:
DeleteExactly right. Jamie (if y'all remember ) notes with relief that Baby Willie's "features were snub, rounded, and resembled no one at all". And later, when contemplating the need to leave, reflects that the resemblance isn't yet clear enough to be a danger, but with time, Willie's "bones would emerge" and the likeness be made clear--and Jamie dare not wait for that to happen.
http://forums.compuserve.com/discussions/Books_and_Writers_Community/_/EP304_Of_Lost_Things_SPOILERS/ws-books/89538.249?nav=messages
Don't cry, my lad.....It'll be alright.. Is what the Jamie was saying to Willie in Gaelic
ReplyDeleteThank you, I was wondering what he was saying to Willie.
Delete💔💔💔
DeleteThank you for sharing the news about Mr. Tom. So glad to hear that the prognosis is so good! I always love to hear Tom's take on Clare and the Outlander universe. Sending heaps of positive vibrations to y'all.
ReplyDeleteThank you, Mary. We have fun with Tom and he has fun with us (when he's in the mood to have fun with us. LOL!) He was actually in the examining room yesterday - in a hospital gown (while being prepped for some radiation equipment) - being a wiseguy and cracking new "Deep Thoughts with Tom" jokes. They were quite hilarious...and I'm going to try my best to get him to record some audio for us so we can all have a good laugh. 👍🏼 PS - Love your last name!! ☺️Are you a Game of Thrones fan, too?
DeleteAlmost everything you two said was exactly what we said during our watching.
ReplyDeleteJamie’s Helwater clothes, although wonderful, not what I “saw”in the book.
The “shoveling s***” conversation in a very public place.
Love love Lord John... kind of wanted him to be blonde.
Rodger is truly adorable.
That scene with baby carriage in the woods confused me. Where did the extra guy on horse on Jamie’s left come from? It was a beautiful location. Walking away from the carriage had be saying “you forgot the baby!”
Sleeping with her husband had to happen or the baby thing would have been an issue earlier.
Loved the Dylan song!
Loved that this is Jamie’s story not so much Claire’s. Sam deserves so much praise! Wow!
Did you notice Rodger holding the airplane from his childhood? Such a great moment
Carole your family is in my prayers. You guys got me through a year of my battle eighteen months ago. Sometimes you were my only source of laughter. I went back and watched all your old videos. It was a tough time but I am here to testify this to will pass. I am stronger and healthier than ever. Hang in there!
Have a great week!
OMG Kare. Talk about getting choked up. Thank you for letting us know that. Now that we're going through it in my house, it means that much more. Tom and I listen to a comedian called Sebastian Maniscalco sometimes on our (long assed LOL) drive home from the hospital in Philadelphia...and he gets me through it and makes me laugh...so I totally understand that and am touched that you'd say that about Tracey and me. 😘 I am SO glad to hear you're doing well. God bless you. ❤️
DeleteYeah why isn't Lord John blonde? Love this actor, he is perfect but he needs to be blonde. What's the big deal, they gave Sam red hair, gave poor Kat a frizzy perm, why not dye Lord John blonde? Don't get it, it's an easy fix. And he is pretty enough to putt it off!
DeleteI found the song! The band's name is Walk off the Earth and it's Bob Dylan's "Hard Rain's Gonna Fall" Listening to it now on repeat.
ReplyDeleteTracey and Carol,
ReplyDeleteFirst of all... Fruit Flies!!! I have them too - driving me crazy! I've done the juice in a cup with pin-pricked Saran on top to catch them - only makes more. I've cleared my counters and sprayed (I HATE spraying sh$& in my house!) - helps for a wee minute. Now I have manufactured an ingenious trap of red wine (they swarm me when I'm drinking it, and I can NOT put my glass down ��). I then dabbed molasses all over the top and sides - yes, very messy- and they are swarming and getting stuck, so we shall see. Maddening.
I, too, am happy about the way they portrayed the Jamie/Geneva scene. But ONLY because I did not want our beloved story to be attacked en masse on social media for having a "rape" scene. I never, not for one second thought of it as rape in the book version. Sheesh! People are too freakin' sensitive! It's fiction! It's a story, folks. But I begrudgingly understand.
This episode is only the second time I have sobbed during show Outlander. i can only assume it's because I always know what's coming. Don't get me wrong, I love the show with all my heart - kind of obsessed, actually, with seeing it brought to life, but it doesn't usually hit me hard like the books did.
I'm ready for the hate about my observations on the Geneva thing, so sticks and stones and all that - bring it on.
Great recap as usual, keep 'em coming!
Carla
No hate here. I totally agree with you on the Geneva thing!
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteThanks Carla! I will try the red wine/molasses trick! I've lived in my house for 24 years and they've never been this bad! Someone suggested a new plant might be causing them...and I do root quite a few plants on my windowsill...so maybe they're attracted to one of the newer types I've put up there. PS - LOVED your sheesh/fiction comment. I couldn't agree more. People need to lighten up! Everyone needs to relax and have a laugh (or glass of wine LOL) and not be so sensitive! 😘
DeleteHi all....as much as I love these books, I am one of those that was VERY uncomfortable with the way this was handled in the books (something along the lines of "he put his hand over her mouth and pushed"). I did feel it crossed a line. However, I understand Jamie was worried that if the sex didn't occur, then Geneva might reveal his secrets as she had threatened. I guess I'm just very glad the series handled it differently.
DeleteI didn't think of the Jamie/Geneva scene in the book as rape- (in fact I had forgotten about that until Carol and Tracy mentioned it. I am happy with the direction the show took that scene.
ReplyDeleteThe Geneva actress was driving me crazy because of the strange resemblance to Clare (in the book I thought she had blond hair) and because I could not place where I had seen her before, and then I realized she was on Mercy Street! I did not know that Mercy Street had been canceled and I am a little bummed about that! Shame on PBS.
The Wille / Jamie / Lord John scenes made me cry! Pulling at the heart strings every episode this season.
Clarification on Lord Ellesmere: In the book Jamie is getting the lowdown on Geneva's pregnancy form the kitchen maid in Ellesmere's household (along with the other groomsmen that went). Jamie has know idea that the child could be his, until the maid tells them that Geneva's sheets were clean on her wedding night; that's when Jamie realizes he is the father. The maid tells them that Ellesmere doted on Geneva at first, but when her pregnancy started to show he became angry, and they fought like cats and dogs. So Ellesmere knew the child was not his all along. I find the way it was handled in the show weird and confusing.
ReplyDeleteThat the sheets were clean on the wedding night could indicate either she was not a virgin or they had not consummated the marriage. Makes no difference which. That he doted on her until her pregnancy showed that consummation probably had not taken place. Perhaps he couldn't rise to the challenge. Either way, his doting would have stopped in private, but he would never have humiliated himself or discredited his only heir by publicly announcing that he had been cuckolded. I don't see how the show show's handling of that was weird or confusing.
DeleteThat song at the end was like a knife to my battered heart!
ReplyDeleteGreat to discover Walk off the Earth - Hope we get a Gif from
Julia LeBlanc using 'Hard Rain'
Love you guys, and Tom Too!!
I wished when they cued the song at 1968, Roger/Richard was playing the guitar and singing the song in a pub.
DeleteI really thought we’d see that, too! It would have been a great opportunity to introduce his singing.
Delete😘 right back atcha, Peigi!
DeleteOh yeah. The maid also discussed how the Earl was thought to be incompetent . IT was implied they never had sex.
ReplyDeleteThank you!! Not remembering that has been driving me batty!! 👍🏼
DeleteI love the PMOP I think you called it.The way you laugh and set each other off is so fun. My prayers for Tom and family(yes I made it through the hour mark easily. As a book reader I think this season is hitting the marks. I too read into whats happening so when my non book reader are confused about whats happening I want to give a long explanation how it happened in the book the way I remember it. I resolved not to do that this season and just enjoy. FYI even though it was a weird scene did anyone notice that the singer in the bar was the "sassenech" gypsy that stole Claire and Murtaghs song?
ReplyDeleteThank you, Christy and GOOD EYE!! I never noticed that!!
DeleteI just want to say in the book when Frank is telling Claire he wants to go back to England and take Brianna he does tell her I thought I was being discreet about it so if that not saying I was cheating on you I don't know what it says. I just wanted to say that.
ReplyDeleteMy reading of the whole Geneva looking at Jamie after Lord Ellesmere said the Vile comment was her going "Oh, the red head freaks you out? Well, why don't I just get me some that?" It's her way of rebelling against the whole situation, the one thing she could do to take control of her path...although her execution of said control is not necessarily the best way of handling things...I think she could have gone to Jamie in a more gentile, matter-of-fact manner, asking, instead of demanding, and he may have been a far more willing partner...the entire undercurrent of non-consent gives me a very particular unease...but, no biggie, it's all part of the story, and the show handled the whole thing far better than the book...I thank them for that...
ReplyDeleteAnd oh hey, Carol? It is completely possible to thoroughly enjoy your first time, no pain, no blood, no problems, only good times, baby...trust me...wink wink...yep :)
ReplyDeleteOh, and darling Tom, kick butt and take names!!! You got this, love <3
LOLOL Allyburu!!! Noted!! 😂And Thank you! He's doing just that, I promise! 😘
DeleteThere was "a moment" when Geneva and Jamie were out riding (before he dropped her in the puddle) where Geneva asks Jamie what he finds attractive in a women and he responds that he doesn't think of those things and she calls him a liar. Did you notice the pause and look he gives her? What was that about? Jamie noticing the resemblance between Claire and Geneva? Just something that caught my attention and want to know if anyone else did too.
ReplyDeleteYES!! I noticed and I just thought it was because he was mad that she'd refer to him as a "liar." My husband is a bit wonky about that, too. Think it's an honor thing. BUT I don't know, maybe I'm wrong! I like your theory!! 👍🏼
DeleteMy take on that was Jamie thought "Oh Lord this one is TROUBLE and I don't want any part of this"!
DeleteCarol and Tracey,
ReplyDeleteThank you both again for your recaps. I'm sure that making these aren't always convenient - especially after the summer you've had, Carol (sending prayers for your family) - but know that they're always greatly appreciated. You never fail to give me some good, well-needed laughs.
I've become so accustomed lately to being annoyed by some of this show's choices and changes to characters that it feels like a near painful bending of my pride to have to admit how much I enjoyed this episode. This was definitely a good one, and it's nice to be able to say that. I was so dreading the potential mishandling of the Jamie/Geneva situation, that I brought up my concern to Maril on Twitter a few months ago. I feared they'd use this opportunity to blacken Jamie's character, and her run-around answer (in the form of a question, something like "How do you think that scene blackens him?") certainly didn't reassure me. I had no problem with the book scene, but I know the debate. I'm just so glad they opted to not "go there."
I agree, Willie looks NOTHING like Jamie, but I did love those scenes. Like Tracey, I thought the snake was a sweet change - especially the way it ties into Jamie's brother and to his own treasured Sawney. Besides, I had always wondered how a small child, especially one surrounded by servants, would be able to hide a rosary.
I'm seeing a lot of deserved kudos for Geneva, but I especially like Isobel. The character has a level-headed, Elinor Dashwood/Emma Thompson kind of vibe. I'm also loving LJG, which was never the case for me with the books. Berry is doing a great job.
I'm really hoping we'll soon see the return of "lovable Claire." I love book Claire and have hated the way the show has portrayed her, especially as seen through the eyes of poor, martyred St. Frank (grrr! Don't get me started!). Ive heard too many viewers say they don't like Claire, and that kind of breaks my heart. I hope they will rehabilitate her. The one shot we've seen of that beatific look on her face when she finds the print shop gives me hope. I'm keeping my fingers crossed.
Thanks again for another fun recap!
Dolittle
Hello Ladies!
ReplyDeleteNon-book reader here. Didn’t get a chance to comment last week about this, but since it came up again thought I’d throw my two cents in.
I haven’t seen Claire as bitchy or mean at all during the time we see her. She’s come off as someone who can’t get over losing the love of their life. Yes I did feel bad for Frank, but he made his choice to stay. He didn’t leave because of Brianna and it’s not like he was forced to live as some kind of monk. And the open marriage thing was probably pretty common during that time, it was just never agreed upon by the wife! So I like that they had Claire take control in that respect.
Now for this episode - I believe he would’ve offered himself to Lord John. He has a history of using his/offering his body for various reasons, so why wouldn’t he? I mean he allowed himself to get whipped, beat up (dumb Leghair), wedding night, offered himself to Black Jack to save Claire, the Geneva thing etc. Of course the wedding night was a bit more enjoyable than others and BJR messed with more than his body, but overall it has been something he does especially if it has to do with his loved ones.
I agree with you about Jamie offering himself to LJG, I think the the latter explanation of The Test was a gay panic ret-con, honestly...he Kisses LJG at the end of the scene in the book, and I was actually sad that they left that pretty big detail out of the show...I mean, that's a pretty significant thing forJamie to do...I think by this time, poor Jamie has been passed around so much he probably has a fairly big disconnect from the act itself, and his sense of self. He even explains to Geneva about it just being Feelings roused in her body, not True love. He has a pretty pragmatic approach to sex by now...what he shared with Claire can never be touched by any physical act with another...so why not toss it out to LJG? Its all he has to give, anyways, aside from frienship, which of course, LJG heartily accepts because he is a wonderful human...
DeleteHi Kim! Keep the non-book reader comments coming, please! :)
DeleteThank you for dissecting the episodes!! I enjoy your insights and banter so much each week, and I really appreciate that your video is available so quickly after the episode is aired. You help add layers of storyline that give depth and life to each character and situation, and that keeps the episode alive for a while longer for me.
ReplyDeleteCarol, thank you for gracefully sharing your family's struggle with the MOP community. Thinking of you and looking forward to good progress reports in the coming months. 🌈
so on to the show|. I haven't seen any comment regarding Richard Rankin's role as the dashing your doctor on The Crimson Fields. I was excited to see him cast as Roger because I so enjoyed him in that PBS show. If you haven't seen TCF, it was only one short season, but worth watching, definitely. My only issue with this week's episode was this: why didn't Geneva make sure that she had marital relations with her husband immediately, so as to squash any questions about who sired the child? Seems a no brained to me, could she have been so ignorant so as not to understand the biology behind pregnancy, or so stupid and evil not to care?
Looking good forward to your thoughts!
Could have been she actually enjoyed sticking it to the old goat. He had to either suck it up or admit to the world that he had been cuckolded.
DeleteHi all. I'm a newcomer here (from Pittsburgh) and have really enjoyed the recaps that I've watched so far. I started watching the series before reading the books so I'm now catching up with the books as well. I liked the Jamie-centric episode and the expression on his face as he was riding away really goes right through you. Does anyone else think his face looks more gaunt than in the past? Maybe it's in keeping with the time spent in prison.
ReplyDeleteI agree with you about the Barbara Streisand look to Claire's hair and makeup. I was thinking Laurie Petrie from Dick Van Dyke as well.
I was glad that you mentioned the show A Place to Call Home that David Berry appeared in. I watched the series a few months ago and it's really good. There is a beautiful historic house that is featured in it as well.
Looking forward to the next recap and being a part of the group!
Welcome Ann! Tracey and I are from Paoli, originally...outside Philadelphia. So PENNSYLVANIA REPRESENT! :)
DeletePS - My neighbor Teresa (who is quickly becoming my go-to for non-reader opinions) can't stand Claire's 60s hair to the point of distraction (not that it's not well-done)...and says she thinks she looks so much prettier with her messy 18th century hair! :)
I was not surprised to hear there was a controversy about the rape at Hellwater, until I realized y'all were talking about GENEVA as the VICTIM! When you blackmail someone into having sex with you, you are the RAPIST. It might not have been as ugly, but Geneva is as guily as Black Jack.
ReplyDeleteThe test: I think the books make it very clear that the real test was to see if LJG would take sexual advantage of a person in his charge, knowing they really didn't want to. After BJR, Jamie could never think of a man in that way and he was willing to hang for John's murder to protect Willie.
A modern spin on JAMMF and LJG's relationship might include some erotic undertones that one cannot admit, but let's consider the character.
JAMMF does not lie, especially to himself.
Agreed about the modern spin, Julia. Jamie never intended to do anything with LJG; it was only an offer...to test LJG's honor. About the sex...Tracey and I didn't think Jamie raped Geneva. We were referring to conversations online that have been going on for years about it. Unfortunately there are people out there who forget they're reading fiction - and fiction about 200 years ago, at that - and get upset about certain situations that go on in the books. I just shake my head and scroll on by. :)
DeleteJulia I agree completely with your assessment of the test. I think Tracey was on the right track that Jamie was willing to do whatever he could to protect Willie. I just think his offer wasn't in gratitude, but to makie sure LJG would be honorable enough to be able to put Willie's best interests above his own selfish desires.
DeleteThis was so Jamie's episode. He outshone everyone else, hands down. I thought this was. so far, the best episode of the season and was superb. In the podcast Matt Roberts says that even though Willie did not look like Jamie, he carried himself just as Jamie does. They all saw that in casting him and he was a unanimous choice. He didn't look like him but I could see the same pride and assurance. Lord John. Wow! He and Jamie can both communicate brilliantly and emotionally in complete silence.
ReplyDeleteCarol, I have added both you and Tom to my prayers and hope that progress and healing continue for him.
Thanks, guys, once again.
Thank you SO much, Annette. He will really appreciate that. 😘
DeleteI am so grateful I found your site! I love you guys! I am also a PA girl transplanted in NJ who also went to school in Philly, so when you guys talk I feel like I know you (even though I know I don’t!). I look forward to your videos every week because it’s so great to break down the episodes with people who have read the books. All of my friends that I have turned on to the show have not read the books so I need your videos!!
ReplyDeleteI totally agree with all of your points on this episode. Lord John is one of my favorite characters from the book and I love, Love, Love David Berry. Tracey- I was cracking up when you said Lord John is hot AF because that’s what I was thinking all episode! The scene where Jamie offered himself to LJ was so perfect - it couldn’t have been better played.
Looking forward to more great episodes as I agree with you guys th the first 2 were a liittle underwhelming.
Carol- thoughts and prayers to you and Tom. What horrible thing to have to go through. I can attest to the great docs at U of P. My sister was there a couple years ago with a serious illness and they are amazing. I wish Tom a speedy recovery
Lisa M. From NJ
I'm so happy with this season because we get more Jamie time. I love the books because of Jamie, and the relationship between Jamie and Claire. It's not that I don't like Claire, it's just that I enjoy Jamie's personality more. I admire book Claire (I'd have been dead in 10 minutes flat if I'd gone through the stones) but especially in the first book or 2 she did too many thoughtless, ill-considered things for me to really like her. For me, show Claire is a bit softer and more likable. (and Caitriona Balff is terrific!) I hope it's not blasphemy to not love Claire...
ReplyDeleteSpeaking of Jamie, Sam Heughan is blowing me away this season. Before season 1 when I saw his photo I was ok with his casting but now he IS JAMMF to me. Slow golf clap! Lol
Carol, 2 things: first, I'm praying for Tom and your whole family. I know what a scary and overwhelming time you've had/are having, so I'm praying for peace of mind and comfort for you all. Second, I'm Catholic, so I would love to be able to buy a t-shirt from the MOP store that has "Stinking Papist" on it! :))).
Love you guys and can’t wait to have you in my home again each week.
ReplyDeleteThis was one of my favorite episodes so far. I think we are just getting a chance this season to see what a fine actor Sam is and FINALLY he's getting his chance to shine. I think about everything has been said, but one comment I had about book vs. show. I loved the change of the carved snake vs. the cross. In the book, I never understood how a little boy was going to hid that big crucifix and the fact that he had become a “stinking papist”, but the snake makes much more sense as a reminder of Jamie and will be as dear to him as the Sawney snake was to Jamie as a reminder of his dead brother.
I also loved the LJG and Jamie scenes. David Berry is exactly like I pictured Lord John and he and Sam are perfect as best buds. If you haven’t watched A Place To Call Home, don’t miss it.
Carol, sending light and love to you and Tom as you go through this tough time. I’m sure many of us who follow you have been through similar experiences and know the ups and downs that your days are filled with. Thank you for sharing with your MOP family.
Tracey, your hair looked fabulous this week!
Hey guys, this episode is my favorite. Loved Geneva, Love Jamie and LJG, love William. Roger and Richard Rankin is wonderful.You can all throw things, but I am not bothered by Bree too much. I do think Roger and Bree have some chemistry at least. Now a message for Carol and Tom. I understand what you guys are going through we had a similar experience with my father and colon cancer this summer. All is well and they caught everything, but that was a difficult time and a long recovery. I think colon/gastrointestinal surgery is another nasty one to go through. My thoughts are with you both. Glad to hear that his prognosis is so good. Fight on MOP Tom!
ReplyDelete-Z
Hi ladies, thank you for your recaps every week. I love the in-depth discussion of all the details. Also, you are hilarious, especially when you get each other laughing! Carol, you got me this week with your "prunes" comment (referring to Lord Ellesmere's cajones).
ReplyDeleteAs someone said above, in the books Lord Ellesmere was "incapable" of consummating the marriage. I don't know why he waited until the baby was born to make any comment about Geneva being pregnant by another man!
One thing about this week's episode that I haven't seen anyone comment on - in the books I don't think Claire went back to Boston because she gave up the search for Jamie - I think she found out about him, decided she would probably be going back through the stones, and went back to Boston to get her affairs in order. No big deal, just a slight difference that I noticed.
Carol, best wishes for healing and health to you and Tom. I admire how y'all are handling this with strength and humor. <3 <3
Lisa in Georgia
Yes, they play it differently in the show than the book...spoilers ahead, y'all, she goes back to Boston, sans Bree, to say goodbye to her 20th century life, her job, and Joe, after having possibly found Jamie...but I'm interested to see where they take this little cliffhanger, and hey, is it true they're making us wait two weeks for the freaking Print Shop?!? Oy Vey...
DeleteTracey and Carol, I love your videos. I knit while I listen/watch, and sometimes I drop a stitch or two because you make me laugh so hard sometimes! Whoever thinks you're rude can't have any siblings, or just doesn't get how it's your familiarity and love for each other that makes it click, I'll rewind to catch the look on Carol's face sometimes when Tracey can't resist and jumps in ....sorry, too gushy? anyways, reminds me of me and my sis sometimes ... lol.
ReplyDeleteAnyhoo... I've taken to calling Lord Ellesmere...Lord Jabba the Hutt :)
Thinking PurgatoryPositive thoughts for Tom and his continued recuperation and recovery! Wow. Such and worry; wishing you and him all the best.
It may take you time to read all the posts, but I'm waaaay behind on commenting, but, oh, well, here it goes... I think someone else mentioned house plants and fruit flies. A small dish with half a grape and a few tablespoons of apple cider vinegar, covered with a tight seal of cling wrap and then a few holes punched in the top, left somewhere in the kitchen will get rid of those nasty pesky things. Regular vinegar won't work...apple cider vinegar all the way!!
I'm "loving" Terry Dresbach's 60s costumes: loving them in their accuracy, but not in the look! Claire would have likely dressed at home as a '60s housewife and mother would have dressed while at home (not a super attractive look, but accurate, I think...same with the hairdos! Wow!)
I think that as post-War Brits, Claire and Frank would have struggled a bit after moving to the U.S. Not as an excuse for Frank's snobbishness, but they did both live through the war in England (and Claire was on the Front as a battlefield nurse, PTSD, etc.), and there was much in the way of rationing and they would have done without a lot during wartime. Also, they were married just before the war, then separated through the war, where Claire was at the Front, and Frank was in London, then the trip to Scotland was their time to "reconnect" on a second honeymoon. I think, originally, Claire did love Frank, but considering her nomadic upbringing and her wartime experiences, their relationship may have ended up not so great...but lucky for Claire...JAMMF!!!
Roger losing Rev. Wakefield makes me sad when I read those parts....also, the corkboard that Rev. Wakefield had....with all the newspaper articles and bits and bobs and notes, etc., I may be mis-remembering and that's from a later part in the series...trying to not be spoilery.
I'm sure that Lady Dunseny would not have tolerated staff that didn't look neat and tidy at all times! Well-groomed groomsmen for the Lady of the House.
I love your videos!!! Thank-you. I believe you when you say you read them all...so, don't have to post a "thank-you for posting" post for me!! LOL. Cheers!
Work has been so busy, that I'm behind on watching your videos! Trying to catch up today before the next episode.
ReplyDeleteWanted to send heartfelt best wishes and positive thoughts to Tom, Carol and the rest of your family. Cancer is terrible, no other way to say it. But I'm thankful that Tom has such a great prognosis.
I just discovered you guys, and delighted! Oh to have a sister that would read! My daughter's husband was in shock that I recommended the series and I love picturing my daughter's face when she said, who do you think gave me the book? That makes me Bennidicta! This was a great episode, and Edie Brickell sang this song for "Born on the Fourth of July". Not sure if the same one, but close. Also Tracy usually nails the stereotypes turned on their head by Diana, but the show totally missed the KISS! I think Jamie kissed Lord John in the book because he accepted that an honorable man could be gay, simply HUGE. But I think they totally missed this, and I attribute this to our totally homophobic culture. I think Jamie was testing Lord John because what if John had been attracted to Willie"s looks? I have a red-headed son, and trust me people are weird about them, so assume Jamie had radar for this sort of thing as does herself....
ReplyDeleteRe-listening to these during droughtlander; My theory for why the Grey boys didn't just marry the Dunsany Girls. In England the 2nd son doesn't inherit so only one brother would be a good match.
ReplyDelete